What to Do When You’re Grappling with a Loss of Self Through a Destabilizing Life Event

In this podcast episode, we sit down with Wellness Coach, Melissa Harris, to discuss what to do when you're facing a major de-stabilizing life event, such as bereavement, divorce, empty-nesting, illness, retirement, or addiction, and how to get yourself back on your feet and moving forward in a positive direction.

If you would like to speak with one of our attorneys, please call our office at (503) 227-0200, or visit our website at https://www.pacificcascadelegal.com.

To learn more about how Melissa can help you, you can visit her website at: https://linktr.ee/melissawyshbone

Disclaimer: Nothing in this communication is intended to provide legal advice nor does it constitute a client-attorney relationship, therefore you should not interpret the contents as such.

Transcript

Intro:
Welcome to Modern Family Matters, a podcast devoted to exploring family law topics that matter most to you. Covering a wide range of legal, personal, and family law matters, with expert analysis from skilled attorneys and professional guests, we hope that our podcast provides answers, clarity, and guidance towards a better tomorrow for you and your family. Here's your host, Steve Altishin.


Steve Altishin  0:02  
Hi everyone. I'm Steve Altishin, Director of Client Partnerships here at Pacific Cascade Legal and today, we have ICF certified coach Melissa Harris, to talk about what to do when you're grappling with the loss of self through a destabilizing life event. Hey, Melissa, how you doing today?

Melissa Harris  0:22  
Hi, Steve, I'm doing great. How are you?

Steve Altishin  0:25  
I'm well, it is not 100 degrees, and that makes me so before we start that, though, I'd really would like you to just talk a little bit about yourself, kind of how you got into this particular type of stuff that you're coaching and kind of what led you there.

Melissa Harris  0:46  
Thanks. I would love to do that. I'd love to share a little bit about my story, which was started about, I would say, about seven, seven years ago. The reason I'm doing what I'm doing today was because of a stable, destabilizing, a life event that happened to me. So in service of what we're talking about today, I'll just share a little bit about that. About seven years ago, I lost my parents, and they both passed away within the same about 10 months apart. So, um, so it was, and it was, and it was probably my real first loss, like real loss, you know, I had some grandparents who had passed, but this was, um, these were my two closest people at the time to me. Um, I was a single person at the time, no children, so they really were my world. And so when that happened, it really leveled me. It leveled me and it and it shocked me and it, it threw me into a, I mean, I'm a seeker by nature, but it really threw me into a seeking phase of my life where I went out and probably in an effort to soothe my grieving and to soothe my hurt, I really went out in search of answers, and in search of those answers, it had had me stop in my tracks for a minute. Some, some sort of inner wisdom had me say, just stop. Just stop everything for a minute. Take a breath. And what I mean by that is I had a, had a very fruitful career going, a very, very, very busy, busy, busy, busy career that was quite demanding and never in my previous thought process would I ever think stop, but this moment said stop. And I did. I took I took a break from my career, and I said I was going to take a couple months, and that couple months turned into about six months where I was working with several different types of support structures, whether that was somatic work that I brought in with a practitioner that I had I had my own therapist that I work with. I had spiritual leaders that I sought out. I had a coach that I sought out. I really was one. I'm one of those seeker people that I was like, I need people. I need help, and I also need to learn how to listen to what it is I need. And through that, through doing that, taking that minute, i i re I was reintroduced to like that higher, higher self, that high that, that deeper part of myself that some people call it your soul. Some people call it, you know, your your the part of you that CO creates with something that's bigger than yourself. You know, if there's if that spirit or what that is to you, whatever that means to you and and it made me look around to every aspect of my life, and that was work and relationship and friendships and my health. It really was like you are. You need to make some changes, radical changes, and things don't feel fully aligned for what I was doing and what I had done up until that, those those many decades of my life, all of a sudden things felt off, and that was just destabilizing in and of itself, you know, because I was just like, wait a minute, how was I not, you know, did I make all the wrong choices? And it wasn't so much that I was making all the wrong choices, I just think that I was recognizing where I was being really, where I had been conditioned, where I had been influenced, where I had been. And pushed, you know, for for maybe different from where I grew up, like the location that I grew up in and and what that environment, you know, how that imposed on me, what my family, my parents, my siblings, how they influenced me, college friends, I mean, you name it. You could keep going all of the things I was looking around and really taking stock at what were my choices, what were my influences, what were really coming from me, and what were coming from outside sources. And I spent a lot of time with it, and I, you know, walked long walks with it, and I journal long journal entries about it. And I, you know, took up different practices that I had never done before just to get connected to myself. And it was so, so it was so, that's essentially, that's, you know, what it was, it was, it was that, that big, big moment that just had me stop and and recognize that, I think it really recognized that. It made me recognize that I had empathy, but I had I didn't have the even the deepest amount of empathy or compassion that that I really had in there, like, it cracked something open inside that, like, and maybe some people, this is what it's called, where your heart opens, or where your heart chakra, or, you know, you just, all of a sudden, you listen to something that's no longer just, you're driven from up here, but you're, you're starting to listen to to down here, more in this heart space, to where I was. I wanted to be in service, you know. So that's where I was looking at the work piece. Because I was like, although I think all of the work that we do is in service of something, I mean, a law firm, legal, you're serving, helping to serve people with major destabilizing events in their lives. And so, you know, the person at the grocery store is serving you to feed yourself. I mean, we all are doing things in service, but I wanted to do something very specific. I think that heart opening, or that that awakening that happened seven years ago awakened something that I needed to do something in a different type of service. And so that's where I sought out, getting various certifications, getting various support studies. I just went into a full education. Coaching was one of the pieces. You know, I wanted to be certified, so I had the skill set to help people. But then I also really wanted to help, like this grief piece, because it was probably because it was my story, was really where I was seeing the need. I just, I was looking around, and I'm like, people are struggling, you know, with various forms of grief depending on what's happening to them in their life. And so that's just so that was kind of the full circle story that led to, all right, I'm going to get, I want to get some training, and I want to help people in this way. And I just It opened my eyes and my heart to the truth of how I wanted to flow from that moment forward.

Steve Altishin  8:15  
I like it okay, and that makes you perfect today to talk to. You know, we're, we are a family law firm, and we come in contact with people who have grief, have destabilizing events, and there's a lot more. It's not more than just someone dying and and something happens, and you can tell when they come in. Can you talk about that a little just sort of, what, what happens to people, kind of within themselves when they experience one of these destabilizing events?

Melissa Harris  8:52  
A lot of things start to happen first, I think there, I think number one, there's just, there's shock. Shock is like the biggest thing that I think people experience, and that kind of gets them in a place of, you know, where they can't move, like a stuckness, the shock creates this stuck moment of what just happened is this, is this real? Did this? Is this, you know? So there's like, a little bit of, like, denial, you know. And really, you're in this like processing phase of like, am I accepting what has happened, you know? Is this? Is this, is this? Is this my new life now? Is this a Is this a dream? It all feels very surreal, depending on what happened to people. And so I think there's that that's kind of in the initial what happens, and it gets you. I think one of the biggest things too, is it can get you really confused. And that confusion state just you just you can't you don't feel like you can go backwards, you can't go forwards. You're just, and it can be really defined. For the people in your life. I mean, not to, I mean, you know, it's primarily super difficult for yourself, but it's also really hard for people around you who want to help, and they want you to tell them how to help, and you're completely stuck. So I think that's, that's, that's what kind of people initially are in that at that space, and I think if they are willing to go get support, go talk to somebody, either one on one, or talk to get themselves into a group setting that's applicable to whatever life events going on for them, that allows the emotions to start to process it just, it starts it, you know, because you just don't, you don't know what to do, you don't know what to say. Sometimes you don't even know what you're supposed to feel. And so when you get into those spaces where someone guiding that out of you, and you know, again, if it's one on one or group, it just, just go with, go with your gut, go with your preference and and they're guiding that out of you. You start to feel and see what it is you're feeling. And the more you get that out, number one, it's, it's, it's way more healthy for you than to keep it inside. But it also starts that process of moving forward. It's, it's like you will, you will find that if you don't, like initiate that process or let someone help you with that process, you might stay in this space for much longer. And of course, you'll notice that it, it doesn't feel good. You know, it's not meant to feel good. It's actually meant to wake us up. It's meant to hurt and be painful, and to give us an experience of of learning, of radical learning. 

Steve Altishin  11:53  
Yeah, it's funny. You talked about that and and one of the things that you know, when I was reading some of your stuff was you have to hit that. You could call it a wall. They could call it a mech truck. But you, you kind of have to reach that. And it's, it's actually part of regaining your footing and and kind of talk about, then what you know, once that kind of thing happens, jingle, I got to do something. How do you start? How do you then move forward, back onto your path? 

Melissa Harris  12:27  
I mean, the goal is trying to realign, like we get, we we have a set path that our life, you know, is mapped out for us, but we get off of that path, and it's okay, it's, it's like, don't, you know, there shouldn't be any judgment about that. It happens to all of us and, and it's those moments and those life events that happen that are put there to sort of nudge us back, to nudge us back, or, or wake us up, or, or have this, um, this, this moment of aliveness, that is, you know, maybe it's your first time feeling that aliveness, and sometimes aliveness, it doesn't, oh, it's not always like the high, high highs, you know, feeling fully alive as a human. It's like, yes, we have all these, like, joys and excitements and Jubilee and all these positive emotions that happen. But to feel alive is also to have, you know, the light and the dark. So the dark that happens as well is, is just as important for our learning as as the as the light, because I think it's, it's it's for one, how do you appreciate all the good without having the extreme polar opposite? We have to have that polarity. And I think that was something I didn't even you know, it's It wasn't until these things happened to me as well that I didn't understand these you know, how to walk this path, having all of these days of amazing things that happen, and these days of incredibly, incredibly devastating things that happen and feeling so blessed, but then also, like really, really today, you know, you have such extreme experiences that are happening, but they're there, And so what, what you're meant to do is, I mean, it's very difficult in this day and age, and especially in our country, but you're meant to just, if you can slow down for just a minute, even in one day, just slow down in that moment of, if you're having a really, really hard day time, Something's happening because of something that's happened to you. Sit for a minute. Think about it, breathe. What is this? What's going on? What's happening to me? You know, it's, it's, there's the lessons are in these moments.

Steve Altishin  14:55  
That's what I you. You said it was something like, you know. Know, these challenges are opportunities, and, you know, pain, grief, they're teaching you something, yeah, yeah. That was a tremendous kind of way to look at it. 

Melissa Harris  15:13  
I mean, maybe because, you know when, when we're talking about grief, it they usually, it usually centers around, you know, bigger life emotions and bigger life events, but imagine something even more simple, you know, like just, just a daily trigger, you know, something that is just, you know, I don't know the news, a family member, a friend group, work. I mean, there's so many areas of our lives that can create something that you're just it can you can be you can be riding high, and all of a sudden somebody in your world says something, or you hear something, and you're just triggered, and you're now, you're just, you're completely polar opposite of what you just felt. You're feeling anger or judgment or something really, you know, extreme, and I think that's, that's an opportunity for a moment to just stop and be like, What just happened, what just happened in that moment that I went from complete joy and, and, you know, maybe bliss or Just, or just a really satisfactory factory day to, like, completely upset. You know, when you have to take stock of, like, what that was, what's going on for you. Why are you so upset about that? Is there something that it's reflecting about yourself? Is there something going on inside that is, you know, that made you so angry. Are you completely frustrated with the topic that was being talked about? Are you not feeling heard and you're getting frustrated? Are you feeling like you don't have a voice? I mean, there's all sorts of things, but what? But the biggest message here is to take the moment for that self reflection, because the deeper self awareness about why we get triggered or why we have these emotions, helps us to then in the in the long run, as they happen, because they're never going, I mean, these, these things don't ever stop in life. They, you know, they continue to happen to us, but it's but we can manage them much better once we have this awareness. Um, we can, you know, they can come and you get much quicker at being like, oh, okay, that's not mine. That's not mine. That's just a reaction. Or, you know, or whatever the case might be,

Steve Altishin  17:33  
The old saying, Curiosity killed the cat is, Curiosity is what, is, what, what teaches you and helps you? I like the fact that you talk about this whole thing is as you know, experience and embrace the good and the bad and because they're all there and learn more about them and to deal with them.

Melissa Harris  18:01  
Yeah, yeah. I remember, you know, it's like the story I told in the beginning. I can very distinctly remember back right after that happened, and the shock that I, you know, that I personally was in. And I remember, I think it was a workmate who said to me very, very quickly after it happened, and it was like, and I was just so in a, in a, in a frenzy and in a shock, and couldn't think straight half the time. Like, each day, I was foggy. I was and he's like, you know, he's like, you know, Melissa, it's like, it's, it's, I'm so sorry for what you're going through. It's like, you know, it's, it's crazy. It's like, something, you know, we're all gonna go through it. We're all gonna lose our parents, like we're all and it was like that moment, you know, I was so foggy that I was like, Oh my gosh, we are. I mean, it was the simplest thing. But I was like, I was so in my own pain and emotion and grief and shock that I was just like, this is this is something. This is my time. This is my turn. This happens to all of us, and this is, and now it's about, how am I going to walk through this, get through it? I wasn't in a frame of mind yet to be like, What am I going to learn from this? I was still very much in a you know, I just need to get through this. But it was like it was just hearing that was a reminder of like this, this is happening to all of us all the time, events life, events that are highs and lows are happening to humans. You know that's, that's what it is to be human, is to it. They're happening. You know, all through our lives, they're happening all around you. You You know that reminder we always hear. It's like, you never know what someone's going through. So try to be kind because, yeah, you know, it's so simple, but it's so you know, so true.

Steve Altishin  19:51  
It's you were talking earlier about being stuck in the can't go backward, can't go forward. And we see that a lot because that that's. Especially in things like a divorce, it's like you fear what was behind you, and you fear what was in front of you, and you just you, you get like you said, Stop. So if I come into you and I say this, I'm kind of in this position. I mean, I want to do that. I want to be more curious, but, but how do I start? I mean, are there some like things I can do. I know you talked about journaling. There's some, like, just concrete things that I can do to get out of the muck of I'm not going to do anything and kind of do something.

Melissa Harris  20:35  
Yes, there are and, and I think, you know, one of my favorite, favorite ways that I think is is really effective and really simple is when you're when you're feeling like that, if you're just wherever you are, if you can just get up and go move and, I mean, the simplest thing is, like, if you can walk outside and take a walk around the block, like, and I'm trying to make it real simple for those people who are, like, in the middle of a city or in the middle of a neighborhood or at work, and they're in their building, if you can just get up and walk outside and be in silence and and walk around the block. And if you can have access to nature, even better, like, if you can go somewhere and take a hike or a walk in nature, even better, because what that does is it literally calms the nervous system, if you're, you know, if you're breathing, and it can get you a moment of like introspection, where you can just sort of like you have to stabilize yourself For a minute, and then you can almost listen to yourself. It's like, it's like the messages from your heart can come through a little louder, and that's also the whole purpose of meditation. But I understand everybody's meditation journey is very singular and very unique, and not everyone has a relationship or a practice of meditation. So and I even think sometimes meditation, I think it intimidates people, and it and, and I think it's just from a share, like, I just don't know how to do it, or I can't do that, or, you know, and, and I'm, I, I've found that, I mean, I was definitely that person in the beginning too. I was like, I don't, I can't, like, the meditation thing. It's just, like, all I do is loop, loop, loop, loop. I'm just looping, looping. I can't do it. But what I found is that for me, the walking meditation, a moving meditation, has has really started that practice for me and and it has for so many of my clients. And that's the simplest way, because you also by moving you're completely changing the energy of the place you're at, like, if I'm sitting at my desk and I'm stuck in aggravated or wherever I am, if I get up and move and get out of the space and outside with the fresh air and the oxygen going into my brain, that's physically you change physiologically, there's a change that's happening on a cellular level. And then it can just allow you to listen and in that place, then you can maybe just like, that's where the curiosity, that's where you bring in the curiosity, what's happening for me, what's going on here. Why am I so stuck? Why am I so, you know, and just and then the and then the moving, because it's like, such a rhythmic move. That's why I think walking better than running, because it's just like, it's gentle and, and I'm telling you, it sounds so simple, but it really helps, and that would be my number one. 

Steve Altishin  23:30  
Yeah, I love that. You know, when my feeling about moving is that it also you're like you said, you're sitting there, you're getting angry, you're getting frustrated, you know you, you get a move, and you're, you're sensory. You're seeing something new every second, especially like walking more than running. And you see things, and you notice, oh, hold it, there's a cat. And it, it, like said, it kind of helps break you into thinking of other things.

Melissa Harris  23:57  
Yeah, exactly, exactly you you really get out of your self sabotage. You get out of yourself. You just get out of your selfness. Do you know what I mean? You're just self centeredness. It allows you to see the like, it's, it's what's happening is just an emotion that's all it is. It's going to pass. And I think, and then when, what happens when you start moving is it gets that, like energy moving again, so the emotion does pass through quicker, so you're not sitting in it, you know, because there really is something about like, just you can sit and stew that whole thing is and moving gets it going and then, you know, and that's why, also The processing grief with others, whether again, group or one on one, work is helpful because it helps that process, because a lot of times we don't innately know how to do that for ourselves. So that's a good it's really supportive. 

Steve Altishin  24:52  
I like where you kind of hit the you. Know, see how you feel you're after you do these things. Because, you know, it's not just walking around, walking around, walking around, then coming back and sitting it's sort of like, okay, I feel different, and I'm curious. Why do I feel different kind of stuff? 

Melissa Harris  25:18  
The curiosity part is key, and that's why people are always saying, like, do you journal? Do you journal? I think sometimes people wonder, why, like, why is everybody always telling me to journal? Or, why are people talking about journaling so much? And it's really just a simple thing. It's like, when you have when you go out and have that walk and you have that curiosity, it's sometimes really helpful just to jot down, like, Did anything come to you? Like, why? Why are you feeling that way? Like, why did you get so triggered? Or, why? Because when you just jot down a couple sentences, it's like, over time, when you look back, you start to see, you start to learn something. It's like, it's like, the pages just just start to reveal something that you weren't so it's, you know, sometimes journaling is just feels good to just get it out like you would just a deep breath, like you're like, sometimes when I'm really frustrated, I don't just do a deep breath. I do a because it just gets the energy out and the vibration feels. It just moves energy. But I think that sometimes, for some people, that's what writing is. But if it's not, if writing isn't your thing, jotting it down is just so that you can learn about yourself, it's just about a learning you know, it's, it's simple,

Steve Altishin  26:34  
it I love the fact that you're, you're you're going to a coach, or you're going to a therapist, but you're also they're just helping you teach yourself.

Melissa Harris  26:44  
Oh, yeah. I mean, all of that is, you're the you're the one doing the work, yeah, I mean, and you're the one that gets you, you're the one that saves yourself. You know any of those people, any of those support, you know, spiritual leader, any, anybody in that and that realm. They're just guides. They're just helping you. You're the one saving yourself always, you know, but sometimes you just don't really know what to do and what those steps are and how to how to do it. And, you know, putting one foot in front of the other, and that's, that's where those people are, so key to come into your life and help.

Steve Altishin  27:20  
I like that. I like that. We have almost blown through this, of course, so fast. But I just want to talk about one more thing, and you use the term nothing is linear. And I really like that, because we have a lot of people, again, that we deal with, who are, who only see one thing happening, this is going to happen, and then that's going to happen, and that's going to happen, and then that's going to happen, but it doesn't have to be the case, right?

Melissa Harris  27:51  
The thing about nothing is linear, is, I think when it comes to going through a grieving process or processing, process of, or, excuse me, processing of a grieving process that that you're going through is there are different steps. There's, you know, there is acceptance, there is processing. There's adjusting to the world without the people in it anymore, or without the substance in it anymore, or something, you know, because if you're sometimes we lose people in our lives, and sometimes we lose things that make us feel lost to ourselves and you know, and there's also ways to as you're processing and you're accepting and you're adjusting to the world, none of those things are happening like they don't always have to happen in an order. And you don't always have to have, like, the grief container of emotions, which are, like, anger, shock, denial, confusion, all. They don't all happen. Like, first you're going to feel this, then you're going to feel this. They're just happening. And I think it's, it's acceptance of the fact that this isn't a linear process. This is just a process, and it's going to be unique to you, and it's you know, and you can't always go to the next person and be like, how is it for you, you know? Because, and it's beautiful to share, because sometimes that creates comfort and support. But it should be non judgmental, and you should just know that, like, whatever your process is, your process and and it's, it's a beautiful thing, and just allow it, because if you think like I should be here now, why am I not feeling better by now? I should be, I should be, I should be. It's, it's, it's, that has to be removed from the conversation, because it's, you know, that you're unique.

Steve Altishin  29:42  
I think that's really, really, really important for people to understand. Well, I didn't do this, so something's wrong.

Melissa Harris  29:49  
It's really important.

Steve Altishin  29:51  
So we are running out of time, but I do want to ask you if someone wants to get hold of you and talk to you or or, you know. Reach out to you. How can they do that?

Speaker 1  30:03  
You can reach me. My website is wyshbonewellness.com and wishbone is spelt a little bit uniquely. It's spelled W, Y, S, H, B, O, N, E, wellness.com and then it's the same thing on Facebook and Instagram. It's just wyshbone_wellness on both of those. And then I'm also on LinkedIn as Melissa Harris. And I'm so, I'm so, I'm very reachable in all the ways. And I do free events in Los Angeles, if you're in the area, hike in their hiking events, their community, where we get into movement, in nature and emotion, and just it's, they're great free, you know, to help you start processing, if you're really curious about getting that process going for yourself, I do those once a month, and I do workshops for organizations about grief all the time. So those are my key ways of support. 

Steve Altishin  30:53  
Oh good, thank you. Thank you so much, Melissa for being here. You know, to talk about this. You know, grief, loss of self, just all of that kind of stuff. It's just really tough to understand, and you make it well understandable. So thank you very much.

Melissa Harris  31:10  
Yeah, thank you. That's so that's my hope, is just to support people in these hard times.

Steve Altishin  31:15  
I love that. I love that. And everyone else is joining us today. Thank you. If anyone has any further questions, of course, you can reach out to Melissa, or you can post it here, and we can get you connected with Melissa, and until next time, stay safe, stay happy and be well.


Outro:
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